Technomancy's place

2020/05/18 1:38:03 PM UTC

As a community platform for getting help and following/discussing development of a FOSS project, I would prefer...

(more options in thread)

2020/05/18 1:46:01 PM UTC

@s_ol I voted "other", because Slack and Discord are closed source, mailing lists are useful for some stuff, but completely useless for the things I use Slack/Discord/etc for. I would have said IRC a few years ago, but... recent experience trying to run a community on IRC convinced me it's not a viable thing. Not when you have non-techy users, and would prefer to keep spam out.

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2020/05/18 1:47:48 PM UTC

@s_ol Zulip, with topics within streams - too complicated.

Gitter? Too nerdy.

Surprisingly, I had the best experience with Matrix - far from perfect, but it was simple enough to get started with, wasn't overwhelming either.

(All of these are highly subjective opinions, mind you.)

2020/05/18 1:54:14 PM UTC

@algernon
I haven't tried Zulip yet, but agree completely for Slack, Discord + IRC. I hadn't considered Matrix, going to take a look at that ad well.

Gitter is nerdy, and also has just one long thread. I'd like at least to split up things like announcements/release notes, help etc.

Mailing lists I personally struggle to use, so IMO they are out for accessibility as well.

2020/05/18 2:16:15 PM UTC

@s_ol talkyard seems like a great option, though i have yet to try it out myself

2020/05/18 2:31:15 PM UTC

@algernon @s_ol the best thing about matrix is it lets you keep your channel on IRC and let people choose whether to access it thru matrix or freenode; old hackers don't need to give up their clients and newbies get a "modern" experience, and everyone can talk together.

we did this recently with the #fennel channel and it has worked better than I expected.
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2020/05/18 2:35:01 PM UTC

@technomancy @s_ol My only issue about keeping an IRC channel is spam. It happens rarely, but when it does, it kinda destroys the channel until it lasts. The keyboardio channel was moved off of IRC because it became unusable for _months_. Having a fancy client to access it doesn't solve this issue, the spam would be visible in Matrix too, wouldn't it?

(We could have avoided spam by making the channel invite-only or moderated, but that would've killed the channel just as much as spam did.)

2020/05/18 2:50:46 PM UTC

@algernon @s_ol I guess. I've never seen any spam in our channel since it started in 2018. in the #leiningen channel (since 2009) it's happened 2 or 3 times. the #emacs channel had some until they required registered nicks, which is a lot less unfriendly than going invite-only. I wonder if you just got really unlucky.

2020/05/18 2:54:23 PM UTC

@s_ol

getting help: irc, mailing list, issue tracker
following: website, rss, mailing list, changelog

2020/05/18 3:03:36 PM UTC

@MrControl
three suggestions for Matrix already, going to try that out for sure :)

2020/05/18 3:29:18 PM UTC

@algernon @s_ol to be clear, Do Not run an IRC channel and tell Matrix users to set up bridging themselves; this process sucks and is badly documented. what you want is to get the owner of the channel to set up the bridging for the whole channel so it appears to be matrix-native to matrix users. (in matrix terms: portal rooms are bad, plumbed rooms are good)

2020/05/18 6:52:29 PM UTC

@technomancy @s_ol Oh, I did not know you can do that. I guess that'd improve the experience somewhat. Good to know, thanks!

2020/05/19 1:52:37 PM UTC

@technomancy @algernon
with all these Matrix recommendations, are there any homeservers you recommend as well? How maintenance-intensive is self-hosting this software?

2020/05/19 2:32:27 PM UTC

@s_ol @algernon ah shit, yeah that's the biggest downside. everyone I asked says running your own synapse is a nightmare, and no one I asked could recommend a non-flagship host. so I use the flagship like some kinda chump, which defeats the purpose of federation.

2020/05/19 3:02:08 PM UTC

@technomancy
did actually manage to set it up just now (i think?) - still have to make myself server admin somehow :P

If anyone wants to test, I should be @s-ol:s-ol.nu

2020/05/19 4:17:59 PM UTC

@technomancy
...or not so simple, federation doesn't seem to be working (yet). Might just have to wait for my DNS zone to update though.

2020/05/19 6:00:19 PM UTC

@s_ol My main issue was not setting up, that part was... reasonably easy, at least compared to some of the stuff I have to run. Problems appeared when I (or my users) joined a big room - that ate a lot more resources than I could spare, so for now, I'm opting to not run my own homeserver yet. Not until I have to upgrade my hardware anyway.

So as @technomancy said, _running_ it is kind of a nightmare. The setup part is "eh", but it sadly goes downhill from there, not up.

2020/05/19 6:36:39 PM UTC

@algernon
@technomancy
I see... thanks for the heads up. I'll keep an eye on resources and do some trials

2020/05/20 12:06:09 AM UTC

@veer66 @algernon @s_ol it's possible! since they haven't implemented federation yet it's too soon to say.

in general it's a pretty bad sign if a supposedly open standard has only one implementation, so it's probably a step in the right direction.